(This is taken off of Oprah's website:)
Gavin says the word "no" is different for men and women. "When a man says no, it is the end of a discussion. When a woman says no, it is the beginning of a negotiation," he says.
Christian and I had a long discussion about this (with a large amount of crying and blubbering on my part) because this is very true for me. And I'm noticing that my kids are becoming masters at negotiation. And I don't like it. We also discussed other situations late into the night pertaining to this subject and I now feel much better thanks to my awesome husband.
My question is: does Every Woman (capitalized on purpose) feel this same way, or have you learned how to truly make the word "no" mean no? If you have learned how to make the word no mean no, is it easy for you or is it a process? Is it easier in some situations, and more difficult in others?
P.S. It's interesting how things/concepts seem to come into our lives as we are ready to accept or learn them. I apparently needed to hear this quote and talk about it with Christian. And I had a big laugh when I told Christian, "I haven't read The Gift of Fear yet because I am scared to." Yes, I realize the irony and yes, I am really, really working on facing my fears. More posts in the future about this...
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I have mixed feelings about The Gift of Fear. I think that it's a great help to women, who tend to ignore their instinct in favor of being nice.
On the other hand, I have seen women turn into crazed, paranoid people because of the book, who everytime they have an off feeling, think they are going to get raped.
His quote is interesting. I have to think about it more.
I saw that when it was replayed late into the night and I couldn't sleep and I had a lightbulb moment when he said that same quote. When Steve says no he doesn't change his mind. Period. Me on the other hand... it struck a cord with me and I wanted to call my sister in law and have her take the test to see if it fit the qualities of her ex husband to see if it fit.
I have learned to say NO and mean it. When you deal with addicts sadly you have to learn that quickly or things get worse. But it can depend on who I'm saying no to as well.
And about fear... I have a question about that myself. Maybe I'll do a post on it.
Such a true {and frustrating} quote in regards to me. I feel like with, ehme, many things, I just take a little convincing, even if I've already said no. ;)
Do you think it's because we think about things and think about things and then think some more?? I don't think most men stew as much as the majority of women do. Maybe that has something to do with us 'changing our minds'. Like the more we think about the less set we are on that it has to be a big fat NO. Does that make sense??
no...er, maybe yes. Sometimes. IDK. Interesting. And I think you have sparked some very enlightening conversation for me and mine. Thanks. Great post!!!
I have noticed this is true with me. I hate it. But I started giving my 5 year old time out when he would "negotiate" with me. And I add minutes each time he tells me "no." If he reached ten minutes then I took things away, like toys. I only had to do that for about a week, maybe two before he figured out that if he argues with me, he's going to spend a lot of time in time out.
Good luck!
I have never heard of that book. Hhhmmmm
But I love the quote and I think in a big way it can be true.
I know I actually have used that for my benefit with my kids over the years. Kids are big negotiators with mom and when I get to the end of my rope I just call my husband, he says "No" and that is the end of it.
Should that bother me?
It never really has. I kind of like it.
Now if that were the case in our marraige I think that I wouldn't like it but my hubby is respectful so that is good.
But I DO tend to see that out in the world too. Men's voices are heard alot stronger than womens.
Intersting.
I'll be thinking about this today!
I read his book years ago and I can say I mean "no" now and I meant it then. I've never been one to be persuaded from my no. I think this, in a nutshell, is why I've always had a hard time understanding women who are in abusive situations. I highly recommend that book to everyone I know.
I thank my parents for this strength and hope I can pass it on to my children.
Great post !!
I MEAN NO. I hate when men take a "no" from me as a thing to negotiate. When I say no, take it and leave me alone.
Yes, my kids try to negotiate too. I am usually pretty stubborn though and keep with what I said (even if maybe I shouldn't as I just want to be right).. so I think it does mean no for me, sometimes I just need to be not so quick to say it.
Interesting... I think in some situations, no means no (for me), but in others it is a negotiation.
I wonder if some of that comes from the fact that often women don't say what they mean. The whole being coy or saying "I'm not upset" when clearly they are. If what you say isn't what you really mean, why would No actually mean No? And how is the other person to know when it really does mean what you say.
My no means HELL NO. I don't use that word lightly. I would much rather ask for time to think a decision through than say no immediately and then try to be negotiated with. No is no with me. It has given me a "reputation." ha!
I had a rather abusive upbringing and some scary experiences that have made me a huge fan of the Gift of Fear. I listen to that prompting with no questions asked.
Interesting thought.
I have a hard time saying no in the first place in most situations, but in some situations I do not hesitate to say it and I mean it.
I have been working on not being afraid to say no to people when they're asking me to do something for them that I feel like I am too overwhelmed to do. That is what is hard for me.
This actually makes me blood boil a little bit.
Since when does No NOT mean No for women?
Trust a man to think that.
Argh. I've been trying to convince my husband for years that No mean No, and NOT that I'm saying No, and that means keeping doing it because I'm just playing hard to get.
If I can teach my boy (and girls) one things, it's when to say no, and when to respect when someone says no.
ooo. I'm up on my soapbox now...
When I say no, I mean it. I learned that lesson early on when I was a nanny for two spoiled brats (and interesting parents). But, when it comes to the person you love the most (my hubby), I often find myself sacrificing my happiness for his...BUT not to an unhealthy point.
Just before the babies were born I put my foot down and insisted on seeing a chick flick, and refused to see yet another action flick. It was a small victory that I still revel in :o)
You sparked quite a discussion, didn't you?
I'm a little strange in that I don't say no right away, even when I know my answer is or will be no. I give all the reasons why I don't want to do something without actually saying no. And, of course, that gets me nowhere. But Gavin has a point: if I say NO flat out, a lot of times people (husband included) thinks of ways to talk me out of it. Why is that? I don't know.
I've never heard of the book you mentioned, but I'm gonna have to check it out.
My daughters sure think that "no" is an opening to a negotiation. I'm in a constant battle with them to remind them that I already said no, and that's not changing, so stop asking already.
This was a powerful thing to hear. I have never noticed the difference in "no" before this, but it is so right!
I think I will be having a discussion with my husband and sons about this...
Ooooh -- really great food for thought.
I would have to say, when I say NO it definately means NO -- maybe. Well, most of the time. Ok, some of the time.
Alright, maybe the guy is right. Maybe it is the beginning of negotiation...
Kinda painful to look at it that way.
I am very good at saying no. If I think I might be willing to negotiate, no matter who I am talking to, I will say "maybe or we'll see." My kids have already learned that if they want to negotiate they should go find their dad. I am my father's daughter. What can I say? The quote is interesting to think about but I think it is opposite at our house. My husband has a really hard time with saying no or sticking to it once he has. He is just a super nice guy and the yin to my yang so that is probably why we work so well together. ;)
I love your thoughts here, Erin. So important to think about this. I want my boys to have a voice, to know that they can protect themselves, etc. It would be even harder, I think, with girls.
It has taken ME far too long to use my NOs. Far too long.
I think this is such an interesting quote. For the most part when I say no, it means no. Just ask all the kids in primary....I'm getting a reputation for being the leader who expects good behavior. Sometimes at home with Mark, I find that sometimes when I say no, it isn't as firm of a no. I'm not sure why. Interesting topic....I'm sure it will be an interesting discussion when Mark gets home.
wow! that really struck me. I say No and people try and negotiate with me... all the time! Do people just not take me seriously? I take other people seriously when they say No. Hmmm... I need to look into this. Thanks for sharing this post.
Fascinating! I've always had difficulty saying no, especially in close relationships. I tend to hedge or whine or say "What if we do this instead?" or "What about this?" Saying no to my husband is probably the hardest one, and I struggle to find balance in compromising without completely letting his will (which is much stronger than mine) rule our home. I'm glad I married a guy who is firm and resolute because it's required me to be more assertive so that we can truly be partners. Very thought-provoking post!
I keep coming back to this post. Reading it (in my google reader) and then clicking 'Keep Unread', so I can come back.
I have never given any of this much though. Assessing myself..I tend to stick to my no's. UNLESS it pertains to my hubby. There is always room for negotiation. (He's a weakness).
I'm going to watch myself for a while..I am now interested in how I really react vs what I think i do!
I liked that book. And that quote was actually really FUNNY and so true!
Why do women have to sound like men when we say no in the first place? Who is to say that no as a negotiation is a bad thing and that no as a finality is preferred? It's as though women now have to assess how we speak and change it to suit men. Why? Isn't that playing into the cycle of abuse in some way? Be proud of who you are - and if that means you are flexible when the situation merits, then so be it.
Thank you Anonymous - I hadn't thought of it from that angle. You make a great point.
I can say no and mean it both ways. One of my favorite things about my kids is that they are fantastic negotiators. It is also the most frustrating thing...
I figure it will serve them well in the future ;)
What a lightbulb moment (appropriate because of the whole Oprah tie-in). You just gave me valuable insight into one of my parenting problem areas. Yes, no means the beginning of negotiations for me. And yes, my kids are already master negotiators. It drives my husband crazy. I hear him telling the kids all the time "No means no." I am going to have to work on this. No means no, not maybe.
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